Let's bag Apple - iPad thread

Talk about everything but gaming in here!

Moderators: pilonv1, Juzbuffa

Post Reply
Vzzzbx
Bob Brown’s Rainbow Cumrag
Posts: 5484
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 06:38 pm
XBL ID: Fairlie Arrow
PSN ID: vzbxvzbx
Steam ID: vzbxvzbx

Let's bag Apple - iPad thread

Post by Vzzzbx »

Starting with this shit.

I don't know how many of you are on top of this, but Apple decided a while ago to force publishers who have iOS apps to offer the same price or less through in-app purchases so that Apple gets its 30% cut of the profits. That in itself isn't a big deal (if you overlook the data that publishers rely upon from sales but don't get when Apple demands in-app purchases).

The problem began when Sony's Reader app was submitted for approval. Apple chose that exact moment to knock back the app for breaking the above (hitherto unenforced) rule and then announce 'oh by the way, we're suddenly enforcing that rule now'. In other words, bully tactics on a corporate scale.

Now Apple is telling everyone who publishes content through iOS (magazines, ebooks, content streaming apps, etc.) to adhere to the new rules by 30th June or be kicked off the platform.

The key problem I have, particularly where ebooks and streaming apps are concerned, is this: by forcing its rivals to offer in-app purchases, Apple can artificially attract customers to its iBooks and iTunes services by undercutting the competition. It's tilting the playing field in its favour.

One brilliant thing that has come out of this is Google stepping up and undercutting Apple's share by 20%, and allowing them to collect the sales data they need to perform their own analyses, recommend other products to customers, etc.

I have no problem with the owner of a platform demanding a cut of the profits made on its platform, but this new effort by Apple is dirty tricks, pure and simple.
User avatar
itch
Very Regular Member
Very Regular Member
Posts: 3208
Joined: 05 Jul 2006 01:08 am

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by itch »

God, that sounds pretty gay.

But, Apple has sucked looong before now.
-------------------------------------
User avatar
unfnknblvbl
googlebomber
googlebomber
Posts: 9783
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 10:17 pm
XBL ID: unfunk
Steam ID: unfnknblvbl
Location: Just behind GameHED

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by unfnknblvbl »

30%? That's just greed.
The sky calls to us; if we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars
User avatar
Pat
The Fury
Posts: 8060
Joined: 16 Jan 2008 08:43 pm

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Pat »

Sounds like anti-trust.
User avatar
Misly
Blackened is the end
Posts: 1069
Joined: 03 Sep 2006 05:49 pm
XBL ID: Misly
Location: Sydney

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Misly »

Its too easy to bag Apple. Their followers show their stupidity when they claim that Apple first to market all these features that had already existed for years. The sheep are blind to the basic features missing until years later... Apple products have poor hardware features for the price and then they block full utilisation of the hardware through software. Buying Apple products is voting with your money, encouraging corporate control of what you own. Apple sux. Thanks for a thread that let me vent on topic.
:rock:
User avatar
Pat
The Fury
Posts: 8060
Joined: 16 Jan 2008 08:43 pm

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Pat »

Misly wrote: Buying Apple products is voting with your money, encouraging corporate control of what you own.
Indeed, the truth could not be more succinctly put than this.

That said, it could not have happened to a more deserving company than Sony, who have been just as bad as Apple. Case in point: RootKit, OtherOS.
User avatar
van
Regular Member
Regular Member
Posts: 1109
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 07:54 am
Location: melb.au
Contact:

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by van »

Not to mention mtrac or whatever that shit was that made their otherwise stylish PMPs fucking useless for anyone who didn't have a prolapsed arse for a face.

Image
User avatar
lestat
Pixel Count Lestat
Pixel Count Lestat
Posts: 12710
Joined: 03 Jul 2006 11:15 pm
XBL ID: grlestat
PSN ID: grlestat
Steam ID: grlestat
Friend Code: SW-5550-6241-2054
EpicGS ID: grlestat
Battle.net ID: grlestat#1153
Location: Sydney
Contact:

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by lestat »

Still not sure why apple think they deserve a 30% cut. They don't host or produce any of the content these subscriptions provide. Pure greed and can you really blame em, the sheep just fall into line when it comes to iProducts, content producers should boycott apple and show them who's boss, without the content iProducts are useless.
User avatar
Pat
The Fury
Posts: 8060
Joined: 16 Jan 2008 08:43 pm

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Pat »

While we're putting the boot in:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... ion=justin
Technology giant Apple has admitted that some of its workers in China have been poisoned and that many are regularly working in unsafe conditions.

Apple says the revelations are proof that its audit processes are effective and the company says it is working with its suppliers to provide a safer workplace.

But its critics are calling for action now.

Consumers may love their iPad, iPod or iPhone, but many are not aware about the conditions they are manufactured under.

It seems that the price paid for cheaper goods can sometimes come at a great cost to the health of the company's workers.

Julia Gooding from New York-based China Labor Watch says Apple's transparency is improving, but they need to act to resolve these problems.

"The conditions in Apple factories and across electronics industries are still lacking in safety protection and many other aspects," she said.

"So there's definitely no guarantees for workers in these factories that their safety and their contacts with chemicals or other poisonous materials is ensured."

Apple's own audit identified an increase in workers putting in excessive hours, a rise in children working for its suppliers, and that 137 workers were poisoned at a Chinese firm making its products.

Worryingly, less than a third of the factories put under the microscope passed the Apple supplier code of conduct.


Slow reform

While China Labor Watch has welcomed improved transparency at Apple, it is worried reform remains slow across the manufacturing sector.

But Ms Gooding says incidences such as the China melamine scandal in which a number of child factory workers were poisoned, has helped raise international awareness about the issue.

"And so I think people are becoming much more cognisant of the fact that this is a widespread problem and workers are now becoming more and more aware that they do have rights that they need to exert and that the factories really need to be protecting them as employers to ensure safe working conditions," she said.

Anita Chan from the China Research Centre at Sydney's University of Technology has visited the vast factories of southern China.

She says Apple's report on the matter overlooks other, more serious issues within the industry as a whole.

"The state is not very responsible in a certain way. They [Apple] said that they discovered one particular factory that hires more of these underage workers than elsewhere," she said.

"So Apple is on top of this problem and trying to resolve it. OK, that's fine, but there are more serious [issues] that Apple does not mention in this report.

"And no other proper social responsibility report mentions this problem and that is the speed of production."

Ms Chan says the biggest risk to workers remains lagging health and safety standards in the industry.

"You can see in terms of the health and safety, that is a problem that even China does not recognise... Repeated stress, what is it, RSI injuries, is a very serious problem to identify.

"But the speed of the production line is very fast and for big companies, if they are very good in de-skilling, that means having workers do very, very repetitive movements, very simple repetitive movements, and if you speed it up that means your chance of getting RSI is very high.

"And this is never, never portrayed as a problem."

Apple refused the offer of an interview with The World Today.

A company spokeswoman would only say it takes health and work issues extremely seriously and it is currently working with suppliers to ensure its code of conduct is being adhered to
.
So, Apple supports:
* Child labour
* Dangerous working environments
* Industrial poisoning through exposure
* Avoiding manufacturing in places with reasonable OH&S regulations
* Antitrust and anticompetitive behaviour
* Non games

Disgusting :down: :down: :down:

Small print: I know, other companies use this factory, including Nintendo
User avatar
Peppermint Lounge
The End
Posts: 8033
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 09:23 am
XBL ID: peppermintl2k5
Steam ID: peppermintl2k5
EpicGS ID: peppermintl2k5
Battle.net ID: Punchanella#11145
Location: Melbourne

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Peppermint Lounge »

No need to sully this thread with your small print. This is a 'let's bag Apple' thread! Let's go to town Ranch style.
Madmya
Forum Faggot
Forum Faggot
Posts: 19118
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 01:51 am
XBL ID: Madmya
Steam ID: Madmya
Location: Brisbane

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Madmya »

He's gonna die anyway ay.
User avatar
Pat
The Fury
Posts: 8060
Joined: 16 Jan 2008 08:43 pm

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Pat »

Peppermint Lounge wrote:No need to sully this thread with your small print. This is a 'let's bag Apple' thread! Let's go to town Ranch style.

I can read it just fine. Maybe you need glasses or a better screen than your iphone, assuming thats what youre reading it on. :D

JUST STOP IT, PEP
Froggy
BLD4LBE
BLD4LBE
Posts: 4996
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 10:54 am

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Froggy »

Whilst this is indeedy shitty Apple owners really make this choice when they choose to follow the leader. What I found in Apples favour today is poor Steve Jobs getting worldwide newspaper articles with them saying he's dieing and that one paper had a cancer dr look at a photo of him and give him 6 weeks to live etc. If the guys sick he's clearly wanting to be private about it, he's looked frail for years now but really another reason to hate the media like if the guys dieing the last thing he needs is newspapers getting dr's in to make estimates on how long he's got.
Vzzzbx, you lose again!
Talez
Choc #2
Choc #2
Posts: 8277
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Froggy's basement faking being in the United States
Contact:

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Talez »

Pat wrote: Small print: I know, other companies use this factory, including Nintendo
It's a pity that other companies don't actually audit their supply chain and terminate relationships for egregious and repeated breaches of a supplier code of conduct and force their suppliers to clean up their act.

This is the thing. Apple deals with their supply chain with transparency and actually tries to fix thing and people put the boot into them for ethical violations they've gone in personally to discover and fix.
Vzzzbx
Bob Brown’s Rainbow Cumrag
Posts: 5484
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 06:38 pm
XBL ID: Fairlie Arrow
PSN ID: vzbxvzbx
Steam ID: vzbxvzbx

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Vzzzbx »

Apple does fuck-all with transparency but I'll concede that it seems to be doing a lot more than any other company to rectify this sort of thing.

Also, fuck the whole iNoun thing. Also, fuck everyone who refers to Apple products as though they're people. 'I'm using iPad!' Fuck off.

Also, fuck the Apple rumour mill and fuck everyone who believes it all. Yeah a screen that's wider than an actual iphone, that'll work. You dumb cocks.
User avatar
Cardsy
303
303
Posts: 3642
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 04:23 pm

Let's bag Apple

Post by Cardsy »

Cheer up you miserable bastard! :lol:
User avatar
edgecrusher
BLUE!...YOUR MY BOY BLUE!!
Posts: 2585
Joined: 05 Jul 2006 04:16 pm
PSN ID: edgecrush33
Location: Melbourne

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by edgecrusher »

I've had so many people say to me "why dont you get a iphone?" and i say i dont want or need one and they cant understand that. Get it over it people, its a fucking mobile phone. It wont change your life or make it better.......you stupid fucks

ipad, iphone howabout idontgiveafuck
Everybody be cool.....You be cool
Vzzzbx
Bob Brown’s Rainbow Cumrag
Posts: 5484
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 06:38 pm
XBL ID: Fairlie Arrow
PSN ID: vzbxvzbx
Steam ID: vzbxvzbx

Let's bag Apple

Post by Vzzzbx »

Cardsy wrote:Cheer up you miserable bastard! :lol:
ahahahaha
User avatar
lestat
Pixel Count Lestat
Pixel Count Lestat
Posts: 12710
Joined: 03 Jul 2006 11:15 pm
XBL ID: grlestat
PSN ID: grlestat
Steam ID: grlestat
Friend Code: SW-5550-6241-2054
EpicGS ID: grlestat
Battle.net ID: grlestat#1153
Location: Sydney
Contact:

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by lestat »

Talez wrote:
Pat wrote: Small print: I know, other companies use this factory, including Nintendo
It's a pity that other companies don't actually audit their supply chain and terminate relationships for egregious and repeated breaches of a supplier code of conduct and force their suppliers to clean up their act.

This is the thing. Apple deals with their supply chain with transparency and actually tries to fix thing and people put the boot into them for ethical violations they've gone in personally to discover and fix.
Apple enjoys the largest markup and margins in the industry, so they're profiting the most off the abuse these factories are causing. When people are paying top dollar for products, they have an expectation the product wasn't made with such poor working standards. This is why Apple gets slammed by the press on the topic.

If they prices were lower, then the guilt is transfered more onto consumers imo.
Talez
Choc #2
Choc #2
Posts: 8277
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Froggy's basement faking being in the United States
Contact:

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Talez »

As opposed to what? The 16GB Galaxy S that Samsung until recently had been asking $899 for? The N95 which had a list price north of $1000 for how long?

The only pricing difference between Apple and any other manufacturer that comes out with a phone is that most of the garbage that's released onto the market is sent into deep discounting within weeks of release. The flagships that get decent sales hold their pricing until the next flagship comes along and then they try to sell that for the exact same prices as the iPhones if not more.

But this isn't about who's guilty or not. We can all feel guilty about how things are in SE Asia assembly plants until the cows come home. Nothing would still be done if we all sat around feeling guilty and assigning blame. Who is trying to improve things, publicizing it and standing by their record? Apple. But I suppose "HTC doesn't give a flying fuck about workers in their supply chain in SE Asia*" doesn't bring in the hits to an attention whoring "journalist" like a good Apple story.

* http://goodelectronics.org/news-en/taiw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... eir-rights
So far only HTC has stated that "it has nothing to do with YFO workers and that the latter were hired by a supplier of one of its suppliers." Peter Chou, the CEO of HTC further stated that HTC "would not intervene in the inner management of other companies."
[Click to see hidden content]
During most of our audits, suppliers stated that Apple was the only company that had ever audited their facility for supplier responsibility
--http://images.apple.com/supplierrespons ... Report.pdf
:thefinger:
Madmya
Forum Faggot
Forum Faggot
Posts: 19118
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 01:51 am
XBL ID: Madmya
Steam ID: Madmya
Location: Brisbane

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Madmya »

Can we hate on iTunes yet?
User avatar
GeneraL CyberFunK
Wants it in 8 Directions
Posts: 2896
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 03:28 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by GeneraL CyberFunK »

I hate their poor support... namely for Numbers. I have an ipad and need a spreadsheeting tool for exercise programs and stuff... Only really have Numbers as an option.. and it's fucking shit. Supposedly 250 odd functions and easy to use... umm no.

What sucks is that if you are adept at Excel... some formulas and functions are different in Numbers.. but there is no real manual to explain these functions. You can't call anyone because apparently (as per the rep i spoke to from Applecare) that no one uses Numbers.. they all use Excel... and that there IS no instruction manual for Numbers on ipad... and there is no one you can speak to in Apple to answer your questions on how to use their "most powerful spreadsheeting device" on mobile unit.

I would love to punch the tunnel-cunted slut who gave birth to the dumb chock who devised it.
Vzzzbx
Bob Brown’s Rainbow Cumrag
Posts: 5484
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 06:38 pm
XBL ID: Fairlie Arrow
PSN ID: vzbxvzbx
Steam ID: vzbxvzbx

Let's bag Apple

Post by Vzzzbx »

As we all know, the answer to all your questions is 'why would you want to do that?'

Madmya: Knock yourself out. itunes 10 makes Vista look sensible.
User avatar
GreyWizzard
Boundless Generosity
Boundless Generosity
Posts: 18671
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 07:51 am
XBL ID: GreyWizzard
PSN ID: Grey_AU
Location: Brisbane

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by GreyWizzard »

Let's bag Apples
Image

Now what?
User avatar
Peppermint Lounge
The End
Posts: 8033
Joined: 04 Jul 2006 09:23 am
XBL ID: peppermintl2k5
Steam ID: peppermintl2k5
EpicGS ID: peppermintl2k5
Battle.net ID: Punchanella#11145
Location: Melbourne

Re: Let's bag Apple

Post by Peppermint Lounge »

Bit of a retort about the 30% story doing the rounds.

http://dvice.com/archives/2011/02/opinion-reports.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There have been some weird news reports this week about how Apple now wants a 30 percent cut of any goods sold from within an app, or that developers have to sell their goods through iTunes with Apple taking 30 percent, and that this greed would prompt online app store developers such as Amazon/Kindle and Hulu and Netflix to nix their apps from your iPhone and iPad.

Poppycock. No, worse — tomfoolery. Insane in the membrane. Not even a bad business mind could conjure up such a absurd idea — tell your vendors they only can sell their wares in your store and to cough up 30 percent of revenue. Great idea!

Except not only are the media interpretations of Apple's ecommerce policies ludicrous from a strictly doing-business POV, they're probably illegal. Apple may be many things good and bad, but being bad at business is demonstrably not one of them.

So who in their right mind would believe something so patently and colossally ridiculous?
Apparently a lot of reporters in both the mainstream media and the tech media who obviously have no clue about how business works.

I'll try to get the facts straight on this whole app contretemps — and why "the media" leapt lemming-like to such stupid conclusions — after the jump.
What's The Hubbub, Bub?

The whole brouhaha broke last week when Apple rejected Sony's e-book Reader app. Why did Apple reject Reader? Because the Sony app sold books from within the app, which is a Bozo no-no. Simply, Apple logically wants to vet what is sold under its imprimatur.

I'll let influential publishing newsletter Publishers Lunch, people who know publishing, pick up the story:

Sony's Steve Haber gave the [New York Times] the impression that "Apple told Sony that from now on, all in-app purchases would have to go through Apple." As best we can tell, the two NYT reporters then came to the broader conclusion — without any additional evidence in their filed story — that Apple "has told some applications developers, including Sony, that they can no longer sell content, like e-books, within their apps, or let customers have access to purchases they have made outside the App Store."

But Apple has never allowed third-party e-bookstores to sell e-books through in-app purchases that are not part of Apple's own purchasing program, providing Apple with their 30 percent share. Existing approved reading apps from the likes of Kindle, Nook, Kobo and Google do indeed let customers access outside purchases, but they all send customers to the web browser to make those purchases. None of them provide for in-app purchases, and it's not clear why Sony thought they could achieve something that all of the other major reading apps had avoided.

So nothing has changed except Sony got its publishing panties in a wad for no reason. Your Kindle, Nook, Kobo and Google e-book apps are all safe and sound, Apple isn't changing any policy, Apple's not getting extra greedy, Apple's not punishing Sony — nothing, absolutely nothing, has changed.
Subscription Restriction?

But the story refuses to die because the day after Valentine's Day Apple announced its publication subscription policy, in which Apple says two salient things:

1. "Subscriptions purchased from within the App Store will be sold using the same App Store billing system that has been used to buy billions of apps...Apple processes all payments, keeping the same 30 percent share that it does today..."

2. "f a publisher is making a subscription offer outside of the app, the same (or better) offer be made inside the app, so that customers can easily subscribe with one-click right in the app."

It's number two that's confusing folks and angering some in the magazine publishing world who logically want to avoid coughing up 30 percent of its subscription revenues to Apple. (Personally, I'm with Apple. Imagine Macy's gives a tailor all the tools and patterns and says "Make a dress just for us that only we can sell," then the dress maker tries to sell the dress from the trunk of his car to avoid giving Macy's its cut.)

Now, this has nothing to do with Apple deserving that high a percentage from subscriptions it facilitates through an app, especially considering Google announced its Google One Pass subscription plan under which it clips only 10 percent off the top. Personally, magazines are the last remaining reading material I enjoy more in physical form. But I digress.

Combined with the confusion over the Sony Reader kerfuffle, now people thought Apple was demanding Amazon and Barnes & Noble, et al, along with other content subscription services such as Hulu and Netflix had to sell their wares inside their respective apps so Apple could get its 30 percent.

Except this announcement, as you can read, applies only to content subscriptions. Hulu and Netflix are already content subscription services, so, again, nothing has changed — at least as far as you, the subscriber, is concerned.

Good grief.
Wormy Apple?

Some folks think all of this ridiculous reporting has some legitimacy because Apple hasn't spoken up to clarify. Apple likely thinks a response could backfire by legitimizing the misconceptions. It's like being forced to claim "I'm not a child molester," because of a spiteful neighbor's gossip, and having your defense become the perceived truth. (See The Children's Hour.)

But none of this hand-wringing and "Apple is the Big Brother it decried in its 1984 Super Bowl commercial" is true (at least as far as the prevailing interpretation of these events are concerned) — this is truly a tempest in a teapot.

But why has the reporting on this been more knee-jerk and less discerning than usual? Perhaps a perception worm has turned — not that "the lamestream media" is as singular-acting or -minded as some portray it, but is "the media" now turning on Apple? Tired of playing sheep to Steve Jobs media-savvy shepherd, are reporters now willing to believe nearly anything negative about what is now the biggest, baddest and most ubiquitous brand in technology? Has Apple become the new Microsoft, the company we love to hate? Apple has become Big Brother — grab your pitchforks and torches and let's go get 'em!

Perhaps a topic for future musings.

In the meantime, I can't believe I've expended this much energy on this nonsense. I was going to write about how NFC is going to change our mobile life, but that'll now have to wait until next week.

Until then, I have a Kindle book on my iPad I want to get back to.

(Thanks to my buddy and long-time publishing consultant Mike Shatzkin for helping clarify all this.)
Post Reply