Smartphone advice

[jizzlobber]

Time to switch to iPhone jizz. It's like Windows Phone with apps.

Had 2 iPhones in the past, don't rate them... shitloads of apps but ios is so boring and until now the screens have been puny, iPhone 6+ doesn't do it for me at all.

I'm happy with the m8, it's beautiful.
just needs a bit of getting used to, the things wp8 does well is also missing in ios... like the merging your social apps.

[General Chaos]

Shoulda got the windows one m8 ate eight mate?

[Deef]

Positives -

The One is build solid. Probably the most solidly built phone I have ever handled.

I got a new phone today. HTC M8. Havent had much time to play with it as yet but if its anything like my HTC one then I'll like it.

The salesperson showed me his new iphone, flexible indeed.

I've always thought it a bit stupid that people/reviews comment on build quality, as if one can tell by just holding a device in their hand. Admittedly this does depend on whether you interpret "build quality" as how nice a shape feels, rather than how durable a device is.

And while I prefer metal on a phone, I also think it's a myth that it gives a practical benefit. It allows people to splash the word "premium" around however, and I'd say this and only this is what Samsung were chasing with the Note 4's metal edge. Admittedly (again) it will surely be better than the Note 3's edge; silly silver paint that scratches off as paint would.

Case in point for both points: the recent bending issue with the iPhone 6+. Some group did measured tests.
The three weakest phones: iPhone 6+, iPhone 6, and the weakest of them all, the One M8.
All metal.

The strongest phone: Note 3.
All plastic.

[Rorschach]

Bit harsh Deef. Build quality is exactly what it sounds like. In all the mobile phones I have had, starting with my first Sanyo in Japan, build consistently has fluctuated wildly in the phones I owned. Creaky seams or loose sliding mechanisms etc.

On my last phone, the Motorola, it was well built but had issues. Such as the camera bezel actually being set crookedly in the frame. That is build quality to me and worth commenting on because it us indicative of a phone makers ability to make a phone. And yeah, metal phones last longer than plastic ones, irrespective of how they submit to stress (which is something else entirely). The practical benefit being longevity. You'd be a fool to get an all plastic Samsung phone when you can have something decent like the One or at least something polycarbonate.

[Deef]

Well, not a go at you, but at reviewers holding a device in their hand using the word "feel" a lot to describe how well they think the phone is going to hold up. Much like assessing a car by kicking its tyres.

I agree with your points about crooked or creaky parts though. Don't want none of that. And while there seems to be some wonder-non-educated guess about lastability in every review out there, I can only think of one review that commented on something like the things you mentioned; that being the Note 3's play in its home button. Another thing you would take as a sign of bad build quality: the plastic hum when it vibrates. It's ridiculous.

So, I realise now I've honestly always translated build quality to lastability and nothing else, and have been unimpressed with the guesses on things people can't know. My interpretation will change now to mean both things, while I still refuse to buy pretty much any comment on how well a phone will last in response to stress or impact. Not when a battery cover makes a bigger difference to force distribution than anything else, when an S4 Active has rubber seals no matter how annoying its buttons are, when an all metal iPhone 6+ is weak behind the volume buttons and one of the most likely phones to bend, as is an m8, or when my metal Desire HD got dropped and died outright. Screen was fine, phone was a paperweight. Yeah one example isn't a case, but point is, we can't tell any of that stuff with our hands no matter how perfectly fitted it all is. Meanwhile the Nokia 8210 is a thing.

That means for things like the m8, with apparently great build quality, I interpret that as having no bearing on how well or how long it will actually survive. I don't think you can just say that how well they handle stress "is a different thing entirely". It is a thing. An area that caught real people with the iPhone 6 immediately. It is not however a comment on how well it handles a fall, but neither is metal vs plastic. And my main stance on that is aimed exactly at things like your referral to a metal phone as "decent". You pass it off as a word you can just use, while I'm critical and wonder what really makes you say that if not just the thought that metal is cooler than plastic. And it is, I'd rather a metal phone, practicalities be damned. But lifespan? What makes you just up and say "Yeah, metal phones last longer than plastic ones."? Screens give up long before the plastic does. Who has ever seen a phone with a broken case, plastic or metal? If you saw a phone with a broken case but the screen intact, you'd wonder how that could have happened.

Just to re-clarify, I'd rather have a metal phone. It's cooler; plastic feels tacky. But that is an impression that lingers from objects where large forces actually do apply. I don't like plastic, I just don't see how it's inferior for phones, which need protection from dropping a lot more than from plastic breaking. Who has ever dropped their phone and thought "Oh God, the case!" Where has a plastic phone ever died where a metal phone wouldn't?

[mech]

Case in point for both points: the recent bending issue with the iPhone 6+. Some group did measured tests.
The three weakest phones: iPhone 6+, iPhone 6, and the weakest of them all, the One M8.
All metal.

The strongest phone: Note 3.
All plastic.

Some group eh?

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news ... /index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Consumer Reports did a test of only six phones. iPhone 5 was second best (there goes your metal theory). iPhone 6 and 6+ were 4th and 5th. Again, it's only 6 phones in the test - not enough to give any meaningful data. The relevant quote from the article:

All the phones we tested showed themselves to be pretty tough. The iPhone 6 Plus, the more robust of the new iPhones in our testing, started to deform when we reached 90 pounds of force, and came apart with 110 pounds of force. With those numbers, it slightly outperformed the HTC One (which is largely regarded as a sturdy, solid phone), as well as the smaller iPhone 6, yet underperformed some other smart phones.

Throughout most of our test, the LG G3 and Samsung Galaxy Note 3 bent, then recovered completely from each step up in force. But at 130 pounds, the case of the G3 fractured. At 150 pounds of force, the Note 3's screen splintered and it stopped working.

Impressively, despite some serious damage from our Instron machine, some of the phones continued to work. Several of the screens illuminated and were functional to the touch; we even completed a call from one phone to another.

Below you can see the pictures of the smart phone carnage, but bear in mind that it took significant force to do this kind of damage to all these phones. While nothing is (evidently) indestructible, we expect that any of these phones should stand up to typical use.

Also "build quality" is usually completely different to "how much a phone bends". iPhones and M8s / Ones DO have better build quality than Samsungs - the latest Samsungs have a GAP around the screen ffs, on purpose. Build quality describes exactly that - how well it's built, i.e. how well it fits together, machined, etc. iPhones are a cut above most phones, I think you're in the minority thinking otherwise.

I wouldn't argue, however, that iPhones are less breakable than other phones - plastic ones can take a lot of abuse and can't deform the way metal can. They look a lot nastier though.

[Rorschach]

Well, not a go at you

Hard not to interpret it that way when you directly quote edgecrusher and I and then go on to say how stupid people/reviewers are when they comment about build quality in the very next sentence

I don't think you can just say that how well they handle stress "is a different thing entirely". It is a thing. An area that caught real people with the iPhone 6 immediately. It is not however a comment on how well it handles a fall, but neither is metal vs plastic. And my main stance on that is aimed exactly at things like your referral to a metal phone as "decent". You pass it off as a word you can just use, while I'm critical and wonder what really makes you say that if not just the thought that metal is cooler than plastic. And it is, I'd rather a metal phone, practicalities be damned. But lifespan? What makes you just up and say "Yeah, metal phones last longer than plastic ones."?

I've owned a lot of phones now. Japanese ones tended to be plastic fantastic and did not last compared to their metal brethren. I was changing my Japanese phones every 2 years because the chassis were literally rubbing off by being in my pocket/bag. It was silly because at the time Japanese software was light years ahead of what was going on with Western phones but the build quality wasn't there. The funny thing is, I think the manufacturers designed the phones not to last to force people to re-contract every two years.

Stress and build quality are mutually exclusive. One refers to a phones ability to withstand punishment and the other is how well it is constructed. Simple. Well constructed phones last longer. I'm not saying the One would survive some idiot bending on the back of the chassis any better than an iPhone 6 or a drop from a great height, those are types of stress that only military/professional grade phones are designed to withstand and they is a specific segment of the mobile market that caters to this need.

Since coming back to Australia I've had 4 phones. The original Desire, the Desire S, Razr HD and now the One M8. They are all metal (kevlar in the case of the Motorola), they all still work and look decent. In the case of the S, I have used it as a backup phone from time to time and it is 3 years old. I've always stayed away from Samsung phones because after a year of normal use they look worn out. Samsung to me is just trying to put units out the door as soon as possible to flood the market but neglecting the whole QC process that make Apple and HTC such wonderful builders.

[Deef]

Hard not to interpret it that way when you directly quote edgecrusher and I and then go on to say how stupid people/reviewers are when they comment about build quality in the very next sentence

Well all I can say is I did think it was stupid. I quoted you just because I noticed your post as an example, not because I was aiming at you. Sorry for offending in any case. I actually wrote it without "people" first, and then thought no! Everyone is stupid! I am the only one who is not stupid! Which admittedly doesn't get me far.

Meanwhile your argument is changing my perspective anyway. Mostly.


@mech

Again, it's only 6 phones in the test - not enough to give any meaningful data.

On the contrary really. I see what you're saying but this isn't a case of needing hundreds of samples to make a point, but rather only a few to debunk one. The test simply shows that that the common view of build quality/metal is not connected to a phone's ability to stand up to stress in this way. Something else is. And I'm not arguing that it's the plastic, just that it isn't the metal/common conception of build quality.

Also "build quality" is usually completely different to "how much a phone bends".

That's pretty much what I'm saying. I have just interpreted past usages of the words as "survivability/lastability", which it seems is off the mark.

To say "build quality is usually completely different to "how well a phone survives"... would be the point I'm pushing.


Back to Ror..

Stress and build quality are mutually exclusive. One refers to a phones ability to withstand punishment and the other is how well it is constructed. Simple. Well constructed phones last longer.

But you're doing it again. You're using a term that sounds nice in one place, then basing a further argument on that while changing its meaning a little.

Look at where you've said "how well it is constructed". What defines how well or how badly? The going understanding appears to be about how nicely it all fits together. You and mech have talked in terms of presentation basically, and you're just assuming all that nicely fitting metal equates to lifespan. You go on to say "Well constructed phones last longer." Yes they do if you now define "well constructed" as being "what makes a phone last longer". So which meaning are you using? Because if you are going to say "Well constructed means lasts longer", then you have literally also said:

"A phone's ability to withstand punishment and how long a phone lasts are mutually exclusive."

Which sounds silly to me, but that is what you have said.

I can agree with what you guys say about build quality now, in terms of machining, gaps, creakiness, etc. My whole issue comes from the fact that people grab a phone, look at it and observe things like this, and announce "Ah yes this one will last a long time." I say "No, you can't tell that from these little things; its survivability is beyond what you can see."

Maybe it simply comes down to you seeing a phone's lifespan as defined by its resilience to careful use, and I see a phone's lifespan as its resilience to punishment like drops, sits, etc. I'm surprised to hear of a phone "wearing out" at all. My understanding is basically that a phone works until it takes one drop/crush too many.

[Deef]

Oh, in any case, you have made me understand that when people/reviewers talk about build quality, they are making sense.

[Gamma]

Screens give up long before the plastic does. Who has ever seen a phone with a broken case, plastic or metal? If you saw a phone with a broken case but the screen intact, you'd wonder how that could have happened.

I see this many times each week. Plastic cases crack and split, with cracks usually forming around the charge port, volume buttons, basically anywhere that there's a hole in the outer case that's not round. Web-like hairline fractures are very common on removable plastic backplates. Plastic phones also tend to wear down, precisely as Rorschach described above. Some handsets seem to wear away around the charge port to the point that the plug gets significant wiggle room and eventually starts charging intermittently.

This is all through what I'd consider standard use. I've never seen a metal phone that's worn in the same way, but of course if you drop one with sufficient force you can put a nice big dent in it, and I've often seen this without the screen being affected. There's an important distinction between standard use and dropping a phone though IMO- many seem to forget that a mobile phone is a piece of electronic equipment, not a tennis ball. You can only expect so much when you hammer any phone onto a hard surface, no matter what it's made of, and if the worst that happens is some cosmetic damage then I'd argue the case has served its purpose and you've gotten off lightly for your momentary lack of physical coordination.

I saw an iPhone 6 that was smashed to shit the other day. ~$500 to replace the screen. Fuck that noise.

[Peppermint Lounge]

I've got a free iPhone 5c which is standard work-issue. With the excellent 5c silicone Apple case it actually looks pretty nice and is very durable. Thankfully I could choose my colour.

[Rorschach]

Nice one. The One came with a pretty cool gel case but because of the nature of my work I wanted something a little more robust. Got an Otterbox Commuter, not nearly as chunky as a Defender but still offers a raised lip to protect the screen. Liking it a lot

[Seraph]

I've been umming and aahing over getting a new phone for years now (still kicking around with an Iphone 3gs) and have been thinking about going to the other side (android), since I have some gripes with some of the design choices of the apple gear (specifically, the two big ones are no timestamps on text messages, and it's not recognised through USB as a mass storage device). I'd like a better camera, with flash, too, but that's not an apple issue, that's a really-old-phone issue.

However, there's no such thing as a perfect phone, and I assume that various android devices out there also have their niggling issues and frustrating oversights.
I was hoping that some of you guys here who've got some android experience under your belts could let me know what sort of things I'm going to "lose" if I was to make the switch, and if there are any glaring issues (subjective, I know) that I might be confronted with.

[Rorschach]

Coming from a 3GS you aren't going to lose out on anything that I can see. With Android vs iOS the biggest difference between the two is the ability to customise on Android. IOS has the edge on Android in terms of hardware optimisation but Android has come on in leaps and bounds since Ice Cream Sandwich to where they are neck and neck IMO. Apple makes beautiful hardware but the best phones from HTC, Sony, Motorola and even Samsung show that gap really narrowing. A year ago I was tempted to jump to Apple after a slow Android year but now with the release of L shortly I am happy I stayed on.

[flipswitch]

I think you'll get mostly gains from going from apple to android these days. There's just so many models to choose from, the OS is great, runs very smooth, customisation is a huge advantage, you're not stuck with the stock apps in apple like its bare bones video player which is rubbish ( I've been spoilt by mx player pro).

Google play has come a long way, it now offers a lot more types of content
(Music,movies, newsstand, apps obviously)

[mech]

I think you'll get mostly gains from going from apple to android these days. There's just so many models to choose from, the OS is great, runs very smooth, customisation is a huge advantage, you're not stuck with the stock apps in apple like its bare bones video player which is rubbish ( I've been spoilt by mx player pro).

Google play has come a long way, it now offers a lot more types of content
(Music,movies, newsstand, apps obviously)

It totally depends on your situation though. It would take a lot for me to switch from Apple these days for the following reasons:

- iMessage
- Shared photo streams
- Previous music and app purchases
- Shared music and app purchases across all devices (family iPhones, iPads)
- Facetime

Let alone stuff like:

- Fast, responsive OS
- Really nice UI touches and design
- Excellent hardware design and build quality
- The best customer service I've ever had for a consumer device

Even if Android beats the latter list, which it often does for new features or better hardware, it has all the original stuff to beat. iOS is incredibly sticky, especially if your family and friends use it. Being able to make easy (and free) Facetime audio and video calls is so great, connecting to Android friends is always a hassle.

[mech]

I've been umming and aahing over getting a new phone for years now (still kicking around with an Iphone 3gs) and have been thinking about going to the other side (android), since I have some gripes with some of the design choices of the apple gear (specifically, the two big ones are no timestamps on text messages, and it's not recognised through USB as a mass storage device). I'd like a better camera, with flash, too, but that's not an apple issue, that's a really-old-phone issue.

Text messages have timestamps. Swipe left and you can see them.

[flipswitch]

Fast responsive*

If you keep it on the stock firmware. Both my iOS devices, mainly my iPad 3rd have been extremely sluggish now since the update to iOS 8, so much so that I just bought a Samsung Galaxy s tab 10.5. I just use it for basic Internet stuff, don't run any intensive apps or games, and it's very slow, freezes regularly, pages never load possibly due to low ram, and this is after a full restore setup as new.

My 5s is fairing better being a newer model, but I still had issues with it freezing and having slightly reduced performance. also after a full restore and set up phone as new. I thoughts iOS was supposed to be responsive? Maybe they should only offer iOS 8 to 1-2 year old devices.

Yes, apple devices have excellent build quality, but now so do the competition.

I'm not even going to bother selling my iPad.

[Rorschach]

Apple products are great in that they take on an almost utility like aspect, they always just work with fewer hiccups, their phones especially. I think the one big thing that Apple beats Android on is forced OTA updates that bypass carriers. If you get an Android with whoever (Telstra, Optus etc) they will always stick their shit firmware and bloatware on it for good measure. They have gotten better over time but it is still there. Every update each Android manufacturer chooses to release has to be vetted through the carrier before it lands on your device. And if your phone isn't super popular don't ever expect an update (i.e. Razr HD). Android is great in that you can flash your bootloader and put custom ROMs on them but for some people this can be difficult or a pain in the arse. Apple at least, regardless of how old your phone is, generally pushes out three updates before the hardware is incapable of running it which is great.

Edit - Ecosystem is a big thing too, if you have a lot of purchases with Apple you'll have to start over with Google. One of the reasons I didn't switch.

[Scullibundo]

What are you talking about with no timestamps, Seraph, swipe left.

[jizzlobber]

One odd thing with the m8... Why did they decide to use digital buttons instead of capacitive buttons like the m7?

the screen is longer as a result and the black strip is still there under the screen, I prefer to have the buttons there all the time rather than hidden away which results in an extra step to do anything with the buttons... plus it's kinda ugly having 2 strips down there, it's odd.

and I gotta say the camera is fucking shithouse, I know they were going for low light performance and yadda yadda yadda but there is a real lack of detail even in favourable lighting... I wish they went wish something like the s5 camera so I get nice photos with options to crop and print.

ideally I'd like me Lumia 1020 camera, that thing is an absolute beast.

overall I really like the m8, just a couple of downers.

as for android... don't see what the fuss is about, wp8.1 is a much better experience imo.
if the app situation improves ill be right back, everything works as you'd expect and it's so streamlined and easy to do what you want.

[Madmya]

The fuss is that it's not iOS.

[flipswitch]

Yeah Jizz I agree regarding the camera. I had the M7 and camera was rubbish, like it was made for social networks ie small file size and compressed. Everything else I loved.

[unfnknblvbl]

One odd thing with the m8... Why did they decide to use digital buttons instead of capacitive buttons like the m7?

Because that's the way Android has done things since v3.0, and it's taken this long for manufacturers to get on board with it. I agree though; hardware buttons are far better.

[Rorschach]

I prefer software buttons for the simple fact they don't break or wear out. Most apps are intuitive and the borders disappear when you scroll and reappear when you tap the screen.